"Protected Sex" and ageism... wow, this became a rant.

[natane.livejournal.com]

just a thought...
the phrase "protected sex" really bothers me because i think it's a misleading term.

most of the time, "protected" really connotates "sex with a condom" (or dental dam, but i'm speaking from a perspective of someone who has had sex only with men, so bear with me on this). at least in my experience.

it implies that sex minus a condom is sex with a risk of STDs (which is true in some cases but not in all). sex without a barrier method, no matter the situation, is defined as "unsafe". so no matter what you may use besides a barrier method and how committed of a relationship you may be in, you're having "unprotected" sex and not being "safe".

by extension, barrier methods are seen as the only "safe" way (pregnancy-proof), which kinda annoys me, because you can have sex without a barrier method and not get pregnant. there's about 242556554 other methods of not getting pregnant besides a condom. some of which work much better than condoms!
I apologize for the misleading statistic in this paragraph. I was not trying to provide incorrect information, it was merely a typo. I have removed it since others have more detailed explanations in the comments. Thanks.

ugh. i don't know. it just seems like a really prejudiced and limiting term to me. and i'm getting really sick of being tutted at for having "unprotected" sex by various doctors (all of whom have KNOWN i was on birth control). yes, i didn't use a freaking condom. that doesn't mean i'm unintelligent, being "unsafe", or wantonly risking STDs or pregnancy. yes, i know what they are. yes, i know how to use one. yes, i know the benefits of condoms (and the risks and drawbacks). yes, i can stand up to my boyfriend and tell him to use one, please do not advise me on how to do so.

although some of that attitude, i think, is based on the fact that i'm 18, and therefore, of course, couldn't
- have a committed relationships. cause, ya know, us teenagers just go from relationship to relationship and cheat on each other all the time, and know nothing about fidelity or serious relationships. i'm just sleeping with the entire football team.
- in which both of us are STD free. cause of course we'd be too immature to think about stuff like that, and stay safe and get tested. and all teenage boys are cheating on their girlfriends because they have that masculine high sex drive *gags*, so i should be making him use a condom cause he'll give me something!
- and have no risk of pregnancy*. because, you know, teenagers are all just having sex and half-assedly using the pull-out method, and half of the girls want to get preggers anyway, to keep the guy.

obviously i agree with none of the stereotypes i quoted above. i meant them in sarcasm.

i'm so sick of assumptions based on my age. if i was twenty-five, would doctors act in the same way towards my "unprotected" sex? possibly. probably not.

thoughts? apologies for turning this into a rant. it was at first just a thought about condoms and "protected sex" and i started thinking about instances in the past that emphasis has been put on condoms in my life.

* i will admit there are times in the past i have had a risk, or at least thought i had one, and did not use a condom - and hormonal birth control is not 100% foolproof. so i guess it's more of "an extremely low risk".

Comments

[theatreant.livejournal.com]

"i'm so sick of assumptions based on my age. if i was twenty-five, would doctors act in the same way towards my "unprotected" sex? possibly. probably not."

Probably yes. Age has nothing to do with sex being 'protected' or 'unprotected'. The definition of the term doesn't change when you reach a magical age, it means the same thing to everybody. A condom is, by definition, a device used to PROTECT you from both STI's and pregnancy alike.

From what I can tell your main feelings of frustration are coming from feelings that a doctor (or doctors) are judging you based on your behavior. While I can 100% understand where that frustration comes from, you also have to think that they've probably seen dozens of people who were so assured that they weren't "at risk" and then something happens to them. It's cliché of me to suggest that they're perhaps looking out for your well being, but that just might be it :)

A doctor should never have the right to make you feel embarrassed or annoyed with how they're treating you. If they are, you're well within your rights to calmly tell them that you don't appreciate it and you want it to stop. Either that or find a different doctor.

[natane.livejournal.com]

the problem i have is the attitude that due to my age, sex without condoms cannot be "protected". if i was older, or married, or etc, i think the attitude would be very different, and a lot less condenscending.
and condoms are not the end-all be-all. they are very, very good, for many people in many situations. not all, and it annoys me that so much emphasis is put on them.

i understand that they do deal with situations where patients are uneducated or don't care about their own safety. but it annoys me that i'm catagorized as one of those people, largely, i think, based on my age.

[atalanta0jess.livejournal.com]

I would guess that it would be different with age, or marital status. I've had doctors say things like "oh, we won't test you for that if you're married." I've noted a change in the way doctors have treated me as I have aged as well.

[treiale.livejournal.com]

I have trouble dealing with these ideas myself, -especially- ageism, which grinds my gears more than most things.

I'm 19 and have been in a committed, monogamous relationship for nearly four and a half years. He's been my only partner, and we're engaged. Have been for about a year and a half. I still dislike speaking about my relationship, except to people around my age and younger, because I'm always met with smirks and disbelief, or the assumption that it'll all fall apart soon and I'll go off and have seventy billion girlfriends, like 'all teenagers do'.

Since before we were sexually active I had been considering, and was discussing with my partner, the risks involved in being intimate with each other, and what we'd have to do to ensure we were safe. I've been actively searching for relevant information since before I had a boyfriend. Everyone just assumes that I know next to nothing about sex, pregnancy, and sexuality, and thus I'm treated to all sorts of lectures (half of which are wrong, anyway.)
If teenagers are misinformed, it isn't all their fault. It's only since finding Vagpag that I've been able to find reliable information, and it certainly isn't for lack of trying.

And while I'm at it, I've come to absolutely hate the term 'teenager'. It is, quite possibly, the single most damaging stereotype there is. Teens are meant to be loud, obnoxious, irresponsible, promiscuous, self-absorbed, hormonally-driven drunken drugged up louts. Often we're treated as such, with our problems and thoughts brushed aside just because we fit between the ages of 12 and 20. Not to mention the mixed expectations on what we're meant to be like.

I've been relatively lucky, as I went to a college that was very supportive of the students and had a wide range of staff - sexual health nurses and social workers - who actively tried to dispell the stereotype and gave non-judgemental help when they were asked. But outside the college, and particularly within my own family, teenagers are looked at with scorn and general disapproval... and I don't understand why. Yes, there are a lot of drunken, idiotic louts who have had more sexual partners than exams, who get pregnant and pass on diseases because they don't care about their own health or that of others - but the destructive and irresponsible ones are the minority among us. It's just that they're noisier and get more attention. (And this is not to say that having lots of sexual partners, or drinking, or getting pregnant are bad things... just that sometimes these things can get out of hand if you're not thinking about them and trying to make informed decisions.)

Sorry for being ranty, myself. But it's a topic that makes me want to start brandishing swords. :P

[natane.livejournal.com]

icon = cute.

oh yes. all us teenagers just get infatuated, have sex, and then break up the next week. and it's just teenagers, adults don't do the same.

gaah. i've educated myself pretty darn well, comparatively, about sex and my body. and yet i, too, also get those lectures, even when i demonstrate my knowledge. for example, i was told i shouldn't stack my pills, because it was dangerous, and told that a condition of getting my prescription was agreeing to have my period every six months.

would my knowledge about the matter have been respected if my age didn't start with a one? would i have been required to submit to terms in order to deal with my own health if i'd been over 20? i think not.

and yes. i agree. there are a lot of stereotypes based on being a "teenager", and i'd have to say i see them even among the most educated people. heck, i've even sometimes seen actions based on them in this community!

Yes, there are a lot of drunken, idiotic louts who have had more sexual partners than exams, who get pregnant and pass on diseases because they don't care about their own health or that of others - but the destructive and irresponsible ones are the minority among us.

and there are a lot of people among the adult population who act in that manner, too. and what is said about them? that they're not acting their age, that they're immature, that they think they're still teenagers.

well, f*ck that. i'm 18 and i don't binge drink, i get more checkups than any of the adults i know, i've had less sexual partners in my life than several adults i know have had in the last year, i've never had an STD and unlike many "responsible adults" i practice safe sex (in the sense of not having sex with people unless i know their STD status - and "know" does not mean "he seems nice" or "he says he's clean"), and i've not yet had an unplanned pregnancy, or one planned to "keep" my boyfriend. yet i've seen unplanned pregnancies and let's-have-a-baby-to-keep-our-marriage-together pregnancies among many of the adults i've met.

and while i'm at it, those with serious problems with addiction to alcohol or sex while teenagers are seen as "just being typical horrible teenagers" whereas once someone becomes older, it's a problem. maybe if we paid more attention and put some of these teens in therapy instead of chalking it up to teenage behavior, we wouldn't have so many girls getting pregnant multiple times before they hit 18, or so many teens overdosing or dying of alcohol poisoning.

to the swords!

[kimie-catclaw.livejournal.com]

Just a vote of confidence: my husband and I have been together since we were 16 and 17, respectively. And we pretty much knew we were going to get married, even though the ceremony wasn't until after college.

We didn't have too many people doubt our relationship, but I'm sure there were people thinking that we were "just teenagers." It's been over eight years now, so HA HA, NAY-SAYERS!

[actorgrl04.livejournal.com]

I also hate the term "teenager", although I admit i use it now, because i am no longer a teenager. but i agree, when i was a teen, i was not the typical teen that people sterotype. I didn't drink, do drugs, have sex with lots of people and cause trouble.

my gyno asked me if i was serious with my bf when i asked about birth control. i was thinking "well, whats the difference if i wasn't?" i often wonder what she would've said or done if i said i wasn't.

(frozen) Maintainer Note

[frolicnaked.livejournal.com]

Hi, treiale. I'm writing on behalf of the VP Team to express concern that the attitude and/or wording above do not foster what we consider safe space (http://www.vaginapagina.com/index.php?title=VaginaPagina_FAQ#What_is_.22Safe_Space.22.3F_What_does_.22empowerment.22_mean.3F_What_does_.22accountability.22_look_like.3F) in this community.

Specifically, we are concerned that when you say:

Yes, there are a lot of drunken, idiotic louts who have had more sexual partners than exams, who get pregnant and pass on diseases because they don't care about their own health or that of others - but the destructive and irresponsible ones are the minority among us.

It's making negative judgments and assumptions about other people's sexual choices and motivations. In VP, it's not okay to judge someone based on whether they have sex drunk or their number of sexual partners -- or to assume that people who contract and/or transmit STIs do so because they're uncaring or irresponsible.

Please consider this a warning as well as a friendly reminder to take this opportunity to review VP's policies. You can find more information on safe space (http://www.vaginapagina.com/index.php?title=VaginaPagina_FAQ#What_is_.22Safe_Space.22.3F_What_does_.22empowerment.22_mean.3F_What_does_.22accountability.22_look_like.3F) in our FAQ (http://www.vaginapagina.com/index.php?title=VaginaPagina_FAQ), as linked here:

--What are VP's rules? (http://www.vaginapagina.com/index.php?title=VaginaPagina_FAQ#What_are_the_rules.3F)
--What is Safe Space? What does "empowerment" mean? What does "accountability" look like? (http://www.vaginapagina.com/index.php?title=VaginaPagina_FAQ#What_is_.22Safe_Space.22.3F_What_does_.22empowerment.22_mean.3F_What_does_.22accountability.22_look_like.3F)

You are more than welcome to make a post over in contact_vp or to contact us via email (http://www.vaginapagina.com/contact.php) If you'd like to talk more about this matter or clarify any points; we only ask that you refrain from commenting further here out of respect for the OP. For that reason, replies to this thread will be frozen.

Tori
For the VP Team (http://www.vaginapagina.com/contact.php)
contact_vp

[archangelbeth]

*offers support*
*met fellow at 17, moved in with him at 18, married him at 19, that was in 1991, and we're still married, now with 9-year-old kid*

[tokio.livejournal.com]

I agree that the term "protected sex" or "safe sex" has a lot of baggage and can be misleading.

[natane.livejournal.com]

i'm not the only one, then. thanks :)

Rant right with you.

[xevv.livejournal.com]

I've come to realize that doctors put a lot of faith into the institution of marriage----way more than I personally do. So while ageism is there, I think if you're 25 and having 'unprotected' sex with your HUSBAND, no one bats an eye. You're married. You probably want kids anyways. Even if you (shock, horror) don't, the fact that you're married means you'll find a way to pull through and deal with the responsibilities of having children.

And worst of all, its as if being married protects you from cheating and the risk of STDs. Being married does NOT ensure against adultery. NOTHING does, except the individuals themselves. Yet married people are not expected to use condoms.

Meanwhile, I will probably face this prejudice well into my thirties. I have an active sex life and I have no plans to marry until I feel my relationship will become stressful without taking part in the many priviledges and rights straight people accuire upon marrying in this country. While my trust in my partner is deep enough that I do not worry about STDs, I know that all I have is my trust, regardless of our marital status.

I started having sex when I was 14; I dated the boy for two years exclusively. At that age I had more common sense in my little finger than certain adults I knew had in their entire bodies. I have been told that having sex that young pre-disposes me, statistically, to make bad judgements in the future, drop out of highschool, fail college courses, and earn below the poverty line, but I think that those statistics really only hold water considering the puritanical stigma our country has towards teenagers having sex, leading to unreliable information, misinformation, or no information at all. How can teenagers be expected to behave responsibly when we treat them like complete children and the subject of sex is such a taboo?

A little O/T, sorry, but I still agree.

Re: Rant right with you.

[atalanta0jess.livejournal.com]

Yes...I recently had a doctor (who I otherwise LOVE) say that she wanted to test me for STDs, because they test all women in my age group. But when she double checked my paperwork and saw that I was married, she did a "oh, nevermind...if you're married we don't need to test you." WTF!

[queensugar.livejournal.com]

I also find that the term "protected sex" has become a little -- misleading, as it's used in the culture. Obviously, "protected" versus "unprotected" came up referring to STIs. However, it seems like it has sort of expanded to include the idea that condomless sex is "unsafe" also in regards to pregnancy protection, which as you note is definitely not always true.

One thing I note often in VP, for instance, is use of the phrase "unprotected sex," when the OP's sole concern is pregnancy and they are on hormonal birth control. In which case, of course, the sex was extremely protected from a pregnancy standpoint. But I think people are repeating that because that's what they've taken away from the culture at large.

i'm so sick of assumptions based on my age. if i was twenty-five, would doctors act in the same way towards my "unprotected" sex? possibly. probably not.

Marital status may play an equal or larger part than age, I think. I never got too much flak for my choice not to use condoms, but I have noticed that since I became legally married, doctors are... almost wholly uninterested in my contraceptive/STI-prevention choices. They never even ask. It's come up once, I said we were using withdrawal only, and the doctor didn't bat an eyelash or give any reaction. Next question.

I suspect if you got married tomorrow, even at 18, you'd get less crap about your choices. And if you were 30, you'd probably get less too. Which I find very problematic on both counts. Everyone is capable of making choices for their own body, if they are able to access the information; the important thing is to get everyone the education they need to do it. Judgmental lectures really don't help on that end.

[polish-pirate.livejournal.com]

I just turned 23 and my doctor STILL insists that I should be using a condom, even though my boyfriend and I have been in a committed relationship for almost 2 years, we're both clean and are open about our sexuality and protection methods and I'm on HBC...

I'm not sure if it's the "age" thing or just an old practice that hasn't evolved as quickly as other concepts, but in all honesty it may just be that condom usage plus barrier is just one of the easiest, safest ways and they feel obligated to push that point.

On the other hand, now that several others have mentioned the "marriage" issue I"m really inclined to agree that the institution has a lot of sociocultural weight behind it, there being the assumption that married couples are monogamous, cheat-free and will just "deal" with an unplanned pregnancy...

Sorry, that wasn't really decisive by any sense of the word, but I guess I'm saying I can see both sides pretty clearly, even if I don't agree with every aspect on either end.

Good topic for discussion, though!

[frolicnaked.livejournal.com]

First, real quick, can you not use "clean" to mean "STI-free"? We talk about it in our rules here (http://www.vaginapagina.com/index.php?title=VaginaPagina_FAQ#Why_can.27t_I_use_the_term_.22clean.22_to_mean_.22STI-free.22.3F), but the basic idea is that using a "clean"/"dirty" dichotomy can be hurtful and alienating to some people who have STIs, which ends up being counter to safe space.

Also, just to expand on your points, I'm 28. In the past year-ish, I've had a couple of health care providers suggest I was being sexually irresponsible for: a) not using condoms in addition to another form of contraception; b) foregoing routine gonorrhea and chlamydia screening along with my Pap smear. (And yet since I'm over age 25, the insurance I had then did not pay for routine gonorrhea and chlamydia screenings.)

I think what happens, ultimately, is that health care providers are human. They approach patients with their own set of values, opinions, and prejudices. Some are more likely to equate age with responsibility; some do the same for marriage; some both or neither. A good provider will try to keep those from interfering with what's best for each patient, but: a) not every provider is a good one; b) even good providers have "off" moments or awkward phrasings.

I'm not suggesting that any of those *excuses* condescending or judgmental attitudes from health care providers. But they may help explain why there can be a lot of variation in who gets judgey when.

[natane.livejournal.com]

this is why i love this community :) that others can understand why this bothers me, and contribute helpful thoughts.
the marriage thing, i think, does in fact play a part also. i think if i was married now, the attitude would be a lot different. perhaps still a little unfair because i think young marriages are seen as stigmatized in some places (and most certainly there would be an assumption that i was pregnant, in certain circles).
that marriages make contraception pointless itself is a damaging enough idea though, that anyone married can just deal with a baby, and that they are "of course" not cheating etc.
thanks :)

[imindiaunajones.livejournal.com]

I'm right there with you!

When I was 18 and went for my first "womanly" exam, the NP actually balked at me (and I'm still convinced didn't entirely believe me) when I told her I wasn't sexually active. I wasn't. At all. I'd only kissed maybe 2 guys and, believe me, I was certainly not interested in being sexually active with any of them. ;)

My most recent exam, a year ago, when my doctor completely glossed over the "painful sex" box that I checked on my patient forms I brought it up. I said, "Hey, by the way, sex kind of hurts and I have a feeling that it might be on account of latex condoms, is there anything you can suggest?" (To be completely honest, I was just looking for an excuse to stop using them and solely rely on HBC) And she kind of half-heartedly said, "Well, yes, there's a chance that you may be allergic to latex, we don't use latex gloves here in the office so I can't really tell you whether or not you are but I definitely recommend you keep using condoms."

:-o

'Twas a shame, because I really liked her up until that point. I'm still convinced the only reason she did tell me to keep using condoms is because I had mentioned that I met my boyfriend over the internet (which is true, but it was in the most unlikely and platonic of situations), we've been together for a year and a half, we live together now and we've been completely monogamous.

I'm laying off the doctors for a little while. I've stopped using HBC and since I haven't encountered any abnormalities in the past 6 years of getting paps, I figure (or at least hope) that I don't have too much to worry about. I'd be so happy if I could find a midwife to become my primary provider. Maybe I have preconceived notions about them, but the last thing that I want to deal with right now is a judgmental health care provider and/or one that's trying to hock whatever pharmaceuticals they're affiliated with.

[natane.livejournal.com]

:O

woooooow...

i think i just lost all trust in doctors (joking, sorta).

what the fuck. oh, you could be allergic, but keep using them? for real?

Long comment, sorry!

[wife-and-mom.livejournal.com]

Why does a doctor who is basically trying to do his job by making sure you know condoms are a better choice than nothing at all when you don't want a pregnancy or STI/STD have to be automatically saying/doing that because of your age? Mentioning condoms when talking about it doesn't necessarily mean he's saying you have to use them, it's just an option and perhaps his/her way of getting a point across. If you were already using condoms, he/she would mention other methods also. It is part of his obligation to you as your doctor to make sure you're educated as well as remind you of your options no matter if you're 18 or 40 years old otherwise he would be putting himself at risk of losing his reputation or a lawsuit by not keeping his patients well informed. I don't think anyone really means to stereotype anyone based on age when it comes to that, especially doctors. Some people don't have anyone to talk to them about this stuff and some people think they're educated but really they're not, doctors know this so it's just a precaution to make sure everyone is as educated as they think they are.

I'm 29, I have two kids and am married and my doctor used to always ask if I was aware of all birth control options available to me as well as give me brochures, which now I have an IUD but back before that I used nothing but the pull out method and it's just an example that doctors talk to you about that stuff no matter how old/young you are. Honestly, I would rather them be that way than to act as if they don't care at all.

Young adult is a better term than teenager in my opinion. I'm sorry you feel so frustrated but perhaps you should try asking why they say the stuff they say. You may be surprised by the answer you receive or you may get angry, either way you will be expressing how you feel as well as finding out their intentions and make yourself feel better about it all by taking control of the situation.

Re: Long comment, sorry!

[marionravenwood.livejournal.com]

I agree with you that asking what the question is for might be useful, but I've got to say I get really angry at the type of behavior natane is describing. I think the problem is that it implies that I'm incapable of making my own informed decisions, and it also implies that all patients (especially all women) are the same. It's condescending. I also get enraged by rampant pregnancy testing when pregnancy is irrelevant. For example, a year ago I went in for a tetanus shot and they wanted a pregnancy test. I refused it, because I'm not sexually active, but what really made me see red is that the tetanus vaccine isn't contraindicated if you're pregnant: in fact, pregnant women are urged to get the vaccine if they are out of date! I called and complained as far up the food chain as I could but no one could give me any sort of rationale for why they wanted a pregnancy test, or why they asked me about LMP and still wanted a pregnancy test. I'm still furious about it over a year later.

[atalanta0jess.livejournal.com]

You may want to rethink your phrasing there. There are plenty of smart people in this community, myself included, who have chosen not to be tested before forgoing condoms. Without knowing our specific situations, or our concept of what is an ok level of risk, you really cannot judge that decision. Its almost impossible to make blanket statements about what "any smart couple" would do.

[misspaigeb.livejournal.com]

I could have written this post. I had a new doctor at my last annual and she would not shut the fuck up about condoms. She seriously pushed it on me at least 5 times and I left the office feeling VERY upset. First, she said "I wouldn't be doing my job if i didn't urge you to use condoms" I said OK. The next thing she said was, "Since you're not in a real committed relationship I think you should be tested for chlamydia and gonorrhea and again i must urge you to use condoms."

SINCE I'M NOT IN A REAL COMMITTED RELATIONSHIP? Yeah i'm 19 but my boyfriend and I have been together for a year, almost 2 and I think it's ridiculous to say i'm not in a real committed relationship. because i'm not married, i'm assuming? What if I never even plan on getting married? Does she expect me go on using condoms for the rest of my life, cus i don't. When she said that, it upset me the most. I felt like she was assuming my boyfriend is sleeping around with other girls or that i'm sleeping around and I shouldn't be able to trust him when he says he's been tested. When she tried to push condoms on me for the third time, I couldn't help but snap and say that I've made an informed decision not to use condoms and I really wish she would BACK OFF. I told her that it's not that i never used condoms or never plan to use them with other partners, but with my boyfriend I'm not going to be using condoms.

I realize she probably says this to everyone but honestly I left the doctor's office feeling like shit and I was really upset! I felt like she was being ageist when she said "Since you're not in a real committed relationship" Like i'm not old enough or something?? give me a break. I went ahead and got the STD tests even though I'd just had one and they came back negative just like I told her they would. I felt like just a dumb teenager who can't be trusted to make informed decisions about my sex life. I really just wanted to tell her to "FUCK OFF" and that's the truth. As you can tell, i'm still harboring a lot of anger about that visit. Maybe i shouldn't be so upset but I really felt like I was being talked down to. I haven't switched practices but am still thinking about it, and I'm curious to see how this doctor treats me on the next visit when I tell her I'm still with my boyfriend (GASP) and that we still don't use condoms.

Anyway, you basically hit the nail on the head with this post, I'm so glad i'm not the only one who feels this way!!!

[natane.livejournal.com]

i just hate the feeling of being ashamed of not using condoms, due to the guilt-pushing from docs.
when realistically, i SHOULDN'T feel bad about it. there's nothing wrong with not using them, in my case (no risk of STDs and an extremely low risk of pregnancy), and more than a few reasons not to (he has enough trouble orgasming as is, i have almost a phobia of gloves/condoms, latex [the only type i can get free] smells disgusting and my vag seems not to like it, etc...)
and yet, anytime it comes up in discussion with a doctor, i get treated in a condenscending, "tut-tut" manner, and i really hate it.
and i intend, fully, to tell the doctors here next time i have to deal with them that i don't use condoms, will not be anytime soon, and they really need to drop it. because every time i go in there about something related to sex, they remind me they have a big container of free (latex) condoms in almost every room.

[candycane-09.livejournal.com]

You should switch gynos if you can. Any gyno that is more into talking down to you than discussing your options as a peer or trusted confidant when it comes to your health, is more of a hazard than a help. You should feel able to talk to your gyno without being judged. I recently switched gynos for a similar reason and it has made me more relaxed and well-informed about my own health.

[natane.livejournal.com]

i'm planning on getting a "real" gyno or at least moving to planned parenthood. right now, i'm dealing with the health center on my college campus, because they're close (literally 200 feet from my bed, where i am right now, haha) and free, and i don't know how much medicaid really will cover.

in the past i have dealt a free clinic in my hometown and while they were also semi-uneducated, they were more likely to listen to my opinions and wishes about my own medical health.

the sad thing is that it's a women's college, and all female doctors.

[sullenduchess.livejournal.com]

I completely agree. Actually, I guess I find the use of "protected sex" more confusing than anything...because it's not specifying what you are "protected" from. Dragons? Who knows. And I see people in this comm stating that they've had "unprotected sex", yet they are on HBC of some sort. I think we should stop defining sex as protected/unprotected, and start defining it as with barrier/without barrier, with HBC/without HBC etc. There is so much more to explain that cannot be understood with just protected/unprotected.

Also, I have two anecdotes. Let me preface this by saying I am also 18 and I feel the ageism.

1) I had my first yeast infection at 16, went to the clinic, told the doctor that I was sexually active, used condoms, was not on any medication. She immediately told me that she was prescribing birth control which was confusing because I neither wanted it nor asked for it. She also didn't discuss my options when it came to birth control (which would have been nice because at the time my schedule was not conducive to taking a pill every day...I would have LOVED to know about the nuvaring back then). I felt that she thought I was too incompetent to use condoms properly, and perhaps that because I was a teenager, I wouldn't care about my HBC options? Anyway, I eventually decided that I would try out the pill (Alesse) just to have it as backup. I'm still on it, so I guess I'm contented enough!

2) Every time I visit my doctor, she always asks, "You still use condoms, right?". This drives me insane & I usually just say "Yes", but other than that she's a decent doctor. I feel really comfortable getting exams and she doesn't bitch at me for smoking. But she does seem to have a thing for condoms. I personally don't use them because I feel comfortable with my HBC, my boyfriend has not had /any/ sexual contact prior to me, and we have already discussed what the plan would be in the event of accidental pregnancy (as well as me having discussed it with my mother). I just feel like, even though I might have a plan and be competent enough to make my own choices, my age determines that I am just lying to myself and I'm really not capable of making my own choices.

TLDR;
I feel ya.

[natane.livejournal.com]

your first paragraph just says it all ;D

1) that is ridiculous. i also wish i'd been told about other methods instead of being told "condoms and hormones!" i really want to get an IUD currently, but i'll probably stay on my current monophasic birth control because it does great things for my period. as in, i don't have one.

2) i get asked that at my college health center. "are you using condoms?" well, since i'm STD-free and with someone that is, and on HBC, why would i need to? and yes, i've also had the "what if i get pregnant?" discussion.
i agree. it feels like it's assumed that because of my age, i can't use a hormonal method properly, and i shouldn't be trusted to know my and my partner's STD status.

*sighs*

[knittinggoddess.livejournal.com]

At my last pap, I asked about STI testing, and the doc told me that since I was past the age range of being high risk for infection, it didn't really matter that I was having uncovered oral sex, my risk was so low that I didn't warrant a test. I think many docs just stick to the age range as foolproof assessment of risk.

[natane.livejournal.com]

oh my god. good point.

why are all the condoms rainbow? is it because they're cheap because those who can buy condoms don't buy those? or do they think, perhaps, teenagers are more likely to use them if they're pretty colors?

because i have to say, orange peen doesn't really do it for me... and that's my favorite color, too.

exactly. stop pressuring women to pressure their partners to use a condom, or assuming that if they don't they're uneducated. that's ridiculous, mostly because - hai, we gets pregnants! most women are going to be taking steps to not get pregnant if they don't want to be, and it doesn't have to be a condom. and yes, that bothers me.

it's like the entire responsibility for the male's sexual history and the possiblity of pregnancy is laid upon the woman - because even though the male wears the condom, as a female i see a lot of pressure to "force" your partner to wear one... and that i think might be rooted in the sexist idea that it's men that cheat (and therefore "spread" STDs).

and yet... i'm betting no man goes to a normal, non-sex-related checkup and is offered gratuitous amounts of condoms and asked if he is using them regularly. he might be, but i doubt it.

[neurotic.livejournal.com]

To play devil's advocate, I understand why doctors think it's important to mention condoms. They are the only method of protection that have conclusively been proven to reduce the risk of transmitting HIV when used for oral, vaginal, and anal intercourse (same with dental dams, though they can only be used for oral sex). All other methods of birth control do not work to prevent transmission of STDs, just pregnancy.

I think it's important that doctors make sure their patients know about their birth control options, including condoms, and that condoms and abstinence are the only ways to reduce the risk of STD transmission. It's also important that they talk to patients about STD testing. However, I think it is very rude if they make unsubstantiated assumptions like "your partner has/is/will cheat[ed/ing] on you" and others that you've mentioned. Their job is to help you with your health, not make condescending judgements about your life choices.

I am so thankful that I have a kind, understanding gynecologist who listens to me and believes what I tell her. I have to pay for it out of pocket, since she doesn't take insurance, but it's completely worth it to me. I am 19 and have yet to become sexually active. She doesn't doubt this. Whenever I see her, she always encourages me to call or e-mail if I have any questions at all. All that she asks is that if I am planning to become sexually active soon, or have recently become sexually active, to make an appointment so we can talk about birth control and to test for HIV, chlamydia, and gonorrhea.

[frolicnaked.livejournal.com]

Yeah, I think there's a large amount of "attitude is everything" with respect to provider/patient sexual health discussions. It's part of a provider's responsibility to make sure they're doing their best to support their patients' sexual health. This vary often includes making sure patients are appropriately educated about condom use as well as other contraceptive and STI-reduction choices.

That said, I think (as an educator) that a crucial part of education is making sure information is presented in a way that's accessible, engaging, and relevant to the other people involved. Making negative assumptions, making a patient feel guilty for choosing other options, or otherwise "pushing" one's own opinion onto others generally runs counter to truly educating.

I've had a couple of really good providers who've done this well. For instance, a few years ago, when first asking about an IUD, my NP learned that I was using FAM as birth control. It's a method with a statistically higher typical use rate and a method that tends to have at least its fair share of negative perceptions. When asking about doing a pregnancy test prior to IUD insertion, she worded it like, "Just because pregnancy tests are quick and painless and because it could be really bad to insert an IUD if you are pregnant, I think it's a good idea to test, just to know for sure," and not as, "Since you're not on the pill, there's no way to know you're not pregnant right now except to test," or something similar.

Similarly, earlier this month, I asked my doctor about fitting me for a diaphragm. (I no longer have the IUD and am back to using FAM.) When I asked, he started out saying, "They're not something I generally recommend because they can be harder to use correctly, which can lead to them being less effective." When I explained all the methods I'd tried and all the reasons they didn't work for me or my partner, he went, "Huh. Yeah, this might be your best option."

I was going somewhere meaningful with this. Really, I was. But those stories took a while to type out, and so now I've forgotten.

[halfscripts.livejournal.com]

A few quick thoughts since I don't have the attention span to go through every comment in this thread right now:

I'm 22 years old and Type 2 Diabetic. Every time I meet with my GP and my Endocrinologist they both go batshit over my feet. "Are you checking your feet every day? Omgz what do you mean you walk around barefoot DO YOU WANT STUMPS FOR LEGS??? DO YOU????" <- exaggerated, but not by much. They press the issue heavily because there is a large portion of diabetic patients who have high, uncontrolled blood sugar and as a result develop neuropathy in their feet, get a cut and don't realize when it gets infected, and bad stuff happens. I have normalish blood sugar, have ZERO complications associated with diabetes, and I'm 22. They still press the issue, because it's something important that needs to be drilled into my head even if it doesn't necessarily apply to me at this time.

I don't think it's ageism. I think it's a medical practitioner ensuring that you are aware of the risks of sex that does not increase your protection from STDs and pregnancy. "Unprotected" means you are not taking extra measures to keep these things at bay. Because your doctor isn't your best friend- he/she doesn't know you well enough to know whether or not you are lying to her, or as educated about the risks as you say you are. Yes, it sucks when we have to defend ourselves against those in the medical field- but they see enough pain and suffering to be logically concerned about these things. If I told my doctor "listen, I know the risks of eating that pint of ice cream but I'm going to do it anyway because it's my choice" they can't physically stop me but they CAN caution me against what commonly happens when someone with diabetes eats a pint of ice cream. Does that make sense? They also test me for pregnancy every single time I give blood work/urine samples. They know I'm a virgin and have had pretty much zero sexual contact with anyone, ever. But they still test, because they simply cannot implant themselves into my head and know for sure whether or not I am telling the truth. I'm not offended by this, because I know they're only trying to protect me and save their own asses at the same time.